Cafe con Pam

Leveraging Your Brand with Astrology with Leslie Tagorda

Episode Summary

Leslie Tagorda shares her story of creating her signature AstroBrand™️ framework to integrate Astrology into life and business.

Episode Notes

Listeners, we're back this week with Leslie Tagorda.

Leslie is a podcast host, author, astrologer, and designer. She is a Hawaii-born, Filipino Jewish, third career astrologer coming from classical music (institutionalized oppression), branding and design and now astrology focused on the intersection of identiy, how we present and lead in Work. This journey is rooted from exploring her own identity and worthiness as all she had ever heard growing up, that she wasn't enough. She wasn’t Hawaiian enough White enough, Asian enough, thin enough, smart enough, good enough. She has woven in all her experiences and saw how the language of astrology and harmony applies in how we present ourselves in the world and what we need to reframe to dismantle and unlearn societal’s rules of how we see our individual success, Work and leadership. Today her mission is to be a spiritual and strategic teacher helping entrepreneurs and changemakers turn their wounds into wisdom to become the luminary leaders they are born to be. And her purpose is to innovate astrology as a MOVEMENT in leveraging brand and leadership development combining a unique skillset of branding, business and astrology, in what she calls the AstroBrand™ Method.

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Episode Transcription

Hello everyone. This is Pam, de Café con Pam, the bilingual podcast featuring Latine and people of the global majority who break barriers, change lives, and make this world a better place. Welcome to episode 266 of Café con Pam. Today we have a conversation with Leslie Tagorda. 

Leslie is a podcast host, author, astrologer, and designer. She is a Hawaii-born, Filipino Jewish, third career astrologer coming from classical music, branding and design and now astrology focused on the intersection of identiy, how we present and lead in Work. This journey is rooted from exploring her own identity and worthiness as all she had ever heard growing up is that she wasn't enough. She wasn’t Hawaiian enough, White enough, Asian enough, thin enough, smart enough, good enough. She's woven in all her experiences and saw how the language of astrology and harmony applies in how we present ourselves in the world and what we need to reframe to dismantle and unlearn societal’s rules of how we see our individual success, Work and leadership. Today her mission is to be a spiritual and strategic teacher helping entrepreneurs and changemakers turn their wounds into wisdom to become the luminary leaders they are born to be. Her purpose is to innovate astrology as a MOVEMENT in leveraging brand and leadership development combining a unique skillset of branding, business and astrology, in what she calls the AstroBrand Method.

Listeners, I've been waiting for this interview for months and I am so glad it's here because ever since I learned about Leslie and her work, I could not wait to connect and share her with all of you because it's awesome. During our conversation, you will hear me talk about my interest in astrology and how I never really got into it because of colonized mentality that we talk about too. We talk about how she went from being a musician, a classical professional musician, into now being an astrologer and how it's so cool how she combined astrology and branding and you know, branding is my jam. I used to brand people all the time, and so her talking about the realization of the archetypes of branding and astrology and combining them into business, it like, it's so mind blown and so brilliant and can't wait for you to learn more about it. And really whether you own a business or not, this is definitely an episode that I think will support you in even figuring out more about yourself. She pulls up my chart and kind of confirms who I am, and I'm hoping that in her doing so, we'll allow you to open up your own chart and uncover kind of like the different parts and pieces of you. We kept it simple to Sun, Moon and Rising, and I know those are kinda like the biggest questions that most people have, and the way that Leslie broke it down, it's so cool because you can build a personal or a business brand with your chart. And at the end, this is something that she shared off recording that I'll share at the end actually, because I don't wanna delay this interview anymore. I just want you to listen to our conversation and learn all the things astrology and about Leslie's work, which is so good. Y bueno, sin más, ere is my conversation with Leslie Tagorda.


Pam: Leslie, welcome to Café con Pam. I'm so excited to have you. 

Leslie: Oh, Pam, thank you for having me. I'm so happy to be here.

Pam: So the question that we always start with is, what is your heritage? 

Leslie: Yes, my heritage is a little bit complicated. I define myself as a Hawaii born Filipino Jew. 

Pam: And tell me why. Why is it a complicated?

Leslie: It's really complicated because being born in Hawaiian, there are native Hawaiians, but I am not Hawaiian blooded. So I can't rightfully call myself Hawaiian. And because of my colonial mentality, I've only recently began to accept and love the parts of myself that have been colonized or, you know, approached with genocide. So I've never really talked mostly about being Filipino or Jewish until like really recently, like maybe since like the pandemic. 

Pam: Oh my gosh. How did you uncover this? Or what led you into this journey? 

Leslie: You know when the pandemic happened and we were going through all of these like global shifts and everything was kind of erupting, I had befriended this beautiful indigenous medicine woman, Asher Frost. And because she has been doing this decolonial work for so long, she was sharing some resources with me and I came across a definition of colonial mentality, basically, where a person who is of the oppressed culture doesn't find value in that culture and has shame in that culture. And so growing up in Hawaii, even though there's a lot of like Asian and Pacific Islanders here, there's a cast system from the plantation workers and the Filipinos were always at the bottom of that cast system. So I was really ashamed to tell people that I was Filipino. And I know you can't see me on the podcast, but I look very like racially ambiguous. 

Pam: Yes. 

Leslie: Brown skin. I get mistaken for Puerto Rican a lot, you know, that kind of racial ambiguity. And then my mom is also Jewish. And in Hawaii people don't really know what being Jewish is. And then when I moved to San Francisco in the mainland, I still was met with people who had this kind of underlying antisemitism. And so I would never tell people that my mother was Jewish. And now I'm like, F it. Like I just wanna be who I am and be really proud. And only, you know, in my ripe young age of, you know, 45, I started learning about my culture and heritage and finding a lot of pride in there. 

Pam: I love that. At Café con Pamwe always talk about heritage and what happened to me is I grew up in Mexico City, and so when I came into the US I became a checkbox, and so that's when I started questioning like, why do I have to check a box? I'm just, Pam. That's why I started questioning a lot of the identity stuff that happens in the United States, that it's very unique to the US. I mean, I haven't lived in other like continents, but at least in the Americas, I noticed that the United States is very unique in the sense that your identity is reduced to a checkbox. 

Leslie: And what if you don't fit in those check boxes?

Pam: Correct. Correct. So what did you check off in the check boxes? 

Leslie: It was always other, because they're only recently did they start to add multiracial. 

Pam: Right.

Leslie: Right. Multiethnic. And then even then it was like, okay, wait, am I Asian or am I Pacific Islander? Cause then those were two separate things because the Philippines is part of Asia, but then they're like, Oh no, but Filipinos are too dark. They're definitely part of like, you know? 

Pam: Oh my gosh. It's so nuanced.

Leslie: It really is. And I'm just like, I'm just me. 

Pam: Right.

Leslie: Even like growing up as a multiracial child, like the more of that, it's complicated, right? There's just like always this enoughness because growing up in Hawaii, I love the Hawaiian culture, but was I allowed to practice it cuz I wasn't Hawaiian enough? And then, you know, some of like my Filipino family lovingly, but teasingly would call me the haole, the whitey basically. And I'm like, Wait, I'm not white. You know? 

Pam: Right.

Leslie: And then feeling kind of that shame. And then my Jewish family, like not even meeting my grandfather for many, many years because I wasn't white enough. 

Pam: Wow. 

Leslie: And so those parts of enoughness really shaped my identity and who I am today. And even just like going into the work that I do, all interconnected.

Pam: Yeah. I wanna hear how the stars kind of like shape that.

Leslie: Yes. It's so interesting. I call myself a third career astrologer because I've had like really big portions of my life and careers and other things. And so I started off as a classical musician because my Jewish grandmother had bought me a clarinet when I was a little girl. She's like, You're gonna play the clarinet cuz I love Sunrise Sunset, which is this song from the Fiddler on the Roof. If you, if you're familiar. And then so I got really got the clarinet and I went into classical music and I was just faced with all of this like systemic oppression. And I'm still a classical clarinettist, like that's still a big part of my life, but it's not as prominent cause I just, I couldn't put my heart and soul into this like practice that was always trying to define me and put me in this small little box. So after I become a classical musician, I decided that I wanted to go into web design cuz I was living in San Francisco as like a lot of technology. And I got into branding and web design where we were always looking at like identities, like how do we present ourselves online and this identity we'd wanna craft. And what I'd noticed, because our clients are a reflection of ourselves. My clients are taking forever to finish like their websites because, we couldn't like get to this place of like, what is this information that I wanted to portray? Like, like how do I choose my brand identity? What colors is right? Like are you sure that's right? It was like frustrating beyond a doubt. And then I was going through this like crisis, in my own identity. I was like, What the heck am I doing here? This is terrible. And I realized as a reflection of myself, so I, you know, going to all the outside gurus, I found this book on branding and it was like called The Hero and the Outlaw.  And it was kind of this academic brand book about you need to choose a psychological archetype too.

Pam: Yes.

Leslie: You know, to brand your business. 

Pam: I'm a designer by trade, so I hear you.

Leslie: Right. It's like, what colors do I choose? I like this color, but is not color--

Pam: Based on your archetype. 

Leslie: Yeah. Based on your archetype. I was like, oh my God, this is terrible. One of the things that was underlying all of this is that I've always loved astrology and everything about the stars, and I never really thought that it could be like a job, but I recognize in those archetypes that all of these archetypes are based on astrological archetypes. Same archetypes. And then it was like this flash of an "aha". And I literally was like, looked at my chart and I was like, Oh, Mercury is communications, Venus is attraction. The sun is what we do, the moon is what we need. And all of these things started to come together. And I was like, Dang, this is like a brand map.  This is like a brand outline. And that's where the magic started to finally happen because now my clients weren't guessing in terms of the archetypes that needed to come out in their business. Like we had a map, a one of a kind map. So full circle, my exploration into my identity and like, who are we really supposed to be, It's like, oh, hello. It's already there in our astrological, our natal, or our birth chart.

Pam: I have so many questions. So we're gonna break all of those down. 

Leslie: Yes, Yes, yes!

Pam: So let's backtrack. When you say you're, you're, um, classical musician, were you professionally playing? Like did you go through the whole thing?

Leslie: Yeah, I have a master's degree in classical music performance. Yeah.

Pam: Okay. What was that pivotal time when you were like, This is it, this is not my thing. 

Leslie: For me, like I always loved playing music. I like, I love being in groups and rehearsing and practicing, but when it came down to that competitive, and like classical music is like competitive. Like there's like one spot and there's like a hundred people auditioning and it's paid so low. I was just like, I couldn't do this anymore. So I had to like make it on my own terms. So I was like, okay, how can I still play music? Only choose the gigs that I wanted to play that I didn't have to audition for and like go through like these white women gatekeepers. Because let me tell you, there are a lot of white women gatekeepers. I'm sorry, white women, I don't wanna offend you, but.

Pam: Not all of them, but you know.

Leslie: Not all of them. 

Pam: The ones that do.

Leslie: Yeah. And they're like, you know, really threatened, right? So like if you were a good clarinet player and you might be threatening to some kind of like small little job, like you are not gonna get the calls. So I was like, okay, how can I do this? So that's when I started my design business cuz I was like, oh this is like before like laptop lifestyles and everything like that. 

Pam: Okay.

Leslie: Like I was the pioneer in like laptop life styling. Cause like I wanted to play music. So that's why I started my web design business cuz I knew I could do the gigs that I wanted and then not have to hustle and then make money on the side doing web design. 

Pam: I mean, it makes sense. You know, you're in San Francisco and it kind of like, you know, it's like the mecca of technology. I'm, I'm just so curious, how did we go from music to design,to visual design?

Pam: Yes, you're correct. In realizing there is definitely like there was one little gap. In my entire work life I've had like five years of a corporate job and this was like, the heyday of like the .com. For those younger listeners you might have like read about it, but in like the late nineties, early two thousands, like they were just like giving money away andlike work was just such a party and I ended up getting a tech job. I found like a head hunter and I was nobody like to get a head hunter. This head hunter is like sending me on these like executive assistant jobs and I'm like, I don't wanna do spreadsheets, I wanna work for a tech company doing a tech job. She's like, Okay, little Leslie, calm down. 

Pam: But good for you for asking for what you want though.

Leslie: Yeah, I wish I, I can like, I mean I have that audacity and you know, that kind of gets like learned out of you sometimes. But she finally found me a tech job and I was doing customer support on email for the old POM pilots. I don't know if you remember those POM pilots.

Pam: Wow! Yes.

Leslie: We were the first company to offer tech support email, and I was being trained on how to create training on websites cuz that's the only way we could deliver it to our team in India. And so in the span of like my first corporate job, in the span of like one year I learned how to do HTML and web design and I learned how to create instructional design. They flew me to India. It was so much fun. 

Pam: Nice.

Leslie: And then crash, boom. [laughs] 

Pam: So that's how you kinda like get a taste. 

Leslie: Yes. That's how I picked up those skills. And so, you know, I think for all of us, and what I've learned is like there are no mistakes. There are no failures. Like you go through these, these different experiences to pick up all of the little tools that you need for your future self. 

Pam: I love this. When did astrology come in?

Leslie: Yeah, so I've always dabbled in astrology. I just, I think like when I was like six years old, I told my mom out of the blue, I was like, Oh, I wanna be a star scientist. Cuz I didn't know there was such thing as an astrologer. And part of my reason for going into classical music to study was that I was doing a double major in astronomy and me, not astrology, but like the science part. 

Pam: Right.

Leslie: And classical music for a while. And then the physics got to be too much. I was like F this I'm not doing, I don't wanna take Calculus III [laughs] So I stopped doing that. But once I had found out that astrology existed, like once I found out, I think I was probably like fifth or sixth grade. And we learned about Chinese astrology first cuz we're in Hawaii. And then I found out that I was like, Okay, I'm a tiger. Ooh. And then I found out that I was Aquarius and then I was just hooked. But just self-learning, you know, going to the occult section of the bookstores cuz there wasn't like the metaphysical side, right? Like it was just a cult. And I grab all these astrology books. Um, I just had this lifelong passion, just learning, learning, learning. But, when I moved to San Francisco, I, one of my best friends was a professional astrologer. And so our favorite thing to do every week, we would go to like sushi dinner and we'd have like too much sake, and we'd just talk about astrology.

Pam: How fun!

Leslie: It was so much fun. And then one day we started doing these New Moon ceremonies because like we were in like kind of our mid thirties and our lives weren't going exactly where we wanted to go. Like I was single, I was kind of broke. I, you know, like all these things that were just not working. And so we started doing these New Moon ceremonies and I started getting really intentional about the things that I wanted. Like I wanted a new apartment, I wanted a committed boyfriend, I wanted more money, I wanted this business. And then I was like, Oh my gosh, this really works. Like cuz everything that I intended started to manifest when I started doing these New Moon ritual. And so when I still had my design job or my design business, and we still do design in our business, I was kind of doing these passion projects on the side, creating like these New Moon decks under this other kind of brand name that doesn't exist anymore. They were a little popular. And then one day I was just like, I can't do this anymore. I'm gonna come full out of the spiritual closet, was when I remember I was telling her I had that "aha" moment of seeing a brand in the sky. And it was at that point where all these people, mentors, started coming into my lap and I validated my framework with a business astrologer. She's like, Yeah, those things work. And I, in the grand scheme of things, I've only been doing astrology on brand and business for about five years, but my life has completely changed.

Pam: How fun! So I've played with astrology since I was also very little, but it's, it, it gets complicated for me. And so maybe I've just not learned from the right teacher, I guess. I don't know. I actually, I used to read the horoscopes in the newspaper. My grandfather used to get the newspaper every day. He wasn't a Sunday newspaper, he was a daily newspaper person and so I would always pull the daily horoscopes and I grew up with a very Catholic grandmother, so I was caught with a tarot deck before when I was like 10. 

And she was like, This is blasphemy, like this must be burned, you know. So, there was this like shame around all of those things. But I grew up with a very, I say, a brujo dad, so he's the very like spiritual side, and he taught me reiki when I was little and all the things, and he, so he would always be like, It's fine, you're fine. But my grandma would always come in and be like, No, this is very shameful. And so I kinda like stepped away from it and didn't learn you know, fully because there was this shame around it. But I've always been curious and I actually, fun fact, I always quote you cuz I get your, I got your, I don't know what package I bought from you, but I have something that I got from you. I get your emails and then so I'm, I'm always like, this is what Leslie said about this New Moon, which another fun fact,is we're recording during a new moon. 

Leslie: Yes. Oh my goodness. So many things to unpack there, Pam. Like your poor grandmother, that's colonized mentality. 

Pam: 100%. 

Leslie: Right. Talking about like, this is evil, because before colonizations all of our indigenous cultures had this like deep tradition of spirituality and our physical lives were all combined as one. Right?  And with your Scorpio sun, right? You have a lot of Scorpio energy. You have your Scorpio sun, you have Saturn in Scorpio, you have Pluto and the south node also in Scorpio. I mean, you're kind of psychic, right? Like would you say like your intuition is like on overdrive?

Pam: Yes [laughs] 

Leslie: I believe you probably have a few spirit guides that you work with on the regular, or if you don't yet they've been like, Hello, Pam. 

Pam: Yes.

Leslie: Like, listen to me. Right? And so with that Pluto in Scorpio, super powerful, but next to that south node in this lifetime, you're needing to like let go of all of the distrust, right? Like unlearn and like the power and control like that doesn't serve. Moving into that, more of that embodiment and that more like tactile and sensation, right? Like you don't have to stay in the dark, scary places, right. You like, does that ring something true for you?

Pam: Well, I'm a EFT practitioner. Have you heard about EFT?

Leslie: Yes.

Pam: So I work with the nervous system. It's all about the body. 

Leslie: Beautiful.

Pam: And I actually, for a while, I called myself, I think in some signatures I still have embodied business coach.

Leslie: Perfect.

Pam: Because it's all about like being in the body. And I've told people before, I'm a shadow worker, so I've said that before cuz I don't, I don't like love and light, you know, like no, that's overdone.

Leslie: I think with the shadow work, right, it's like, it's not just about the shadows, it's really like how do you let go of the shadows so you can lead that peaceful like, right? So when I'm looking at a data chart from this like identity and purpose and what you do in your business, it's like, yeah, no matter what, you're gonna bring up those shadows because you're not here to do like the surface work. You wanna go deep, right? That Scorpio energy goes deep, it's super intuitive. You're so emotionally in tune with what's going around, not just in your clients, but because your son is in the 11th house, you are freaking in tune with the collective soul. Ok? So when you're thinking about that shadow work that you're doing, you're not doing it for like one or small groups, you're doing it for society, you're doing it for collective. Just dredging all of that gunk up. Okay? Your moon sign in, Leo, you have this fire moon. Moon is going over your moon right now. So in today, make sure you do a New Moon ritual. This is a very fertile time of month for you, just in ideas and bringing things to life. Just know that. And this Leo New Moon and is in your eighth house and your moon is in the eighth house. It's about like again, the House of Scorpio, deep transformation. But you are doing this deep transformation. Yes, starting off with the deep shadow work, but then replacing that deep shadow with joy and confidence and creativity. You need joy. For you joy is healing. 

Pam: Yes. Totally.

Leslie: And necessity. Now, if I may suggest some edits to your identity in terms of that signature, you have Sagittarius, Neptune, and Capricorn as the archetypal energies that you have to work into your identity, your role, and your leadership. Sagittarius, visionary and inspiring. Neptune spiritual and transcendent. But Capricorn, practical, goal oriented. 

Pam: Right.

Leslie: And so the how you do things and how you lead is from like, I'm gonna inspire the F out of you and we're gonna talk about all of these things to get you out of your mind so that you can do the work that really matters and accomplish your goals. 

Pam: How funny, cuz I think in systems, so I think that's the Capricorn.

Leslie: That is definitely the Capricorn, but systems that enable freedom because the Capricorn lens still comes from Sagittarius. And so these are not restrictive systems. These are opening systems, freedom systems. 

Pam: So fun. I feel like you're totally telling me who I am. 

Leslie: Yes.

Pam: Like confirming. Thank you for doing that. For those who don't know, like the difference between the Sun, Moon and the Rising, cuz those are kinda like the main three. And then there's like all the depths of the houses and the like whatever, whatever, planets and all the things. So could you share what is the Sun, the Moon and the Rising?

Leslie: Yes. So from my kind of framework and I built a framework that I call the Astro Brand Method and branding from a place of like, how do we present and how do we identify, not how do we take like dominion over a market segment, okay. Like I wanna like decolonize that as well, this idea of branding. And so when we think about this presentation in the world, the sun, the way that I look at it in our life and our work is like our creative joy, our creative expression. Because if you think about in the solar system, the sun is the engine of the solar system. Everything revolves throughout the sun. It's its own energy source, and it's just like emanating and radiating pure light. And this is your zone of genius. This is what you radiate without having to think, without having to work and without having to effort. And for most of us, we've been taught that if we don't work hard at something or if there's no effort into something, that it must not be worth anything. So the things that we're really good at from our Sun sign are the things that we're dismissing and putting away. So to reframe our Sun sign is to really know, oh, this is the energy that I have to really confidently talk about and bring out in my life and my work. So for you, that Scorpio, that empowerment, that trust, that intimacy, that deep shadow work.

Pam: So deep. Always.

Leslie: So deep.

Pam: Don't talk to me about like the weather, tell me what are you really curious about? It freaks some people out.

Leslie: They're not your people. [laughs] 

Pam: For sure. So that's the sun. 

Leslie: That's the sun. So our moon, in traditional astrology, our emotions, our intuition, our relationship to our mother, our relationship to our ancestry, and these often create the patterns of when we were little children, what were our needs satisfied or our needs not satisfied. And everything that was created as a pattern because of those first experiences. And so how we take that now into our lives and our work is that our work has to satisfy, like needs to satisfy the needs of our moon. They're not wants, they're not desires. They're absolute non-negotiable needs. And so knowing our moon sign enables us to say like, Oh, what do I need from this relationship?  What do I need from this person? What do I need from this job? Well, for Pam, it's about love and adoration and being creative and being bold.

Pam: And wanting attention, no? Is that, isn't that what leads?

Leslie: Yeah. Yeah. That I, I called it adoration. [laughs] 

Pam: I was talking to a friend about this, and I'm like, my Leo moon is like, I wanna be seen. And my Scorpio son is like, no, we don't.

Leslie: Don't look at me! 


Leslie: Well, and your Leo moon is also in the eighth house, the house of Scorpio. So it's like you want to be adored within the confines of your safe spaces, right? The people that know and trust you, they better freaking love you. Otherwise like, nope.

Pam: How funny. Yes. I have a friend that she's like, You're the queen of boundaries. You know, like you draw the line and that's it. And I'm like, Well, don't people like, isn't that normal? She's like, no.

Leslie: I love that. And what I've noticed that for like young children with fire moons, especially as like from identifying like people, right? Those fire moons oftentimes when we were really little, like we wanted that attention, right? We wanted to be wild, we wanted to be passionate. We just kind of followed our hearts, took all these risks, right? I can imagine you like maybe just like running around, like taking all your clothes off and going, I'm free. And then like your grandmother is like, Pam, Pam, Pam, put your clothes back on. Right? I see this all the time. And so this need to be free and wild and passionate is so, so, so important. 

Pam: How fun.

Leslie: One last thing about the moon sign. It's like when you know the needs, emotional security needs of your moon, make sure that the people that you are surrounding yourself with, the experiences that you're putting into your life and your work fulfill those needs of your moon. Your undercurrent wise needs. Now your Rising sign. In traditional astrology, people would say, This is your personality, this is how people experience you. But when we take it into our work lives and our personal brand or in just like how we wanna present ourselves in the world, we wanna step into that rising sign. And the rising signs can sometimes be a little bit of a stretch. Like I've seen people like really resist their rising sign, but once they really fully step into it, they're like, Oh yeah, this was me this entire time. So it's kind of like meeting people halfway where they expect us to be. But our rising sign shows us not just like how we are meant to dress, but like how we take initiative in the world. Like our morning routines. Right. I'm sure you like to like sweat and like move your body a little bit or like--

Pam: Yes. I work out in the mornings. 

Leslie: Good. And your workouts are pretty rigorous. And like strength building and like bone building, I wanna say.

Pam: I bike, I peloton.

Leslie: Oh. Oh my gosh. Yes. Whew. Not for me, but I'm glad that that is perfectly for you. And so when we think about the initiation practice, like in our businesses, if you're a business owner or even if you're just working and you wanna establish your brand, your personal brand, you're like, Okay, so Pam has to come out as that Sagittarius-Capricorn. And I say Sagittarius-Capricorn, because you have all of Capricorn in that first house. It's a little bit of a higher technique, but just look at your rising signs. Start there. How can you embody that archetype in your leadership? How you take initiatives? So you know that Sagittarius is always that deeper why, that purposeful, that visionary, that I wanna like explore minds and places and cultures. I wanna inspire people to be optimistic and find hope and find social justice and like, hello, is that Pam? Yes. 

Pam: How funny. I mean it's not funny, but it's like so clear.

Leslie: It's wild, right? It's, it is so clear and we can take that to that next level about, you know, designing now or styling a brand identity. Cuz like if we think about that visual identity that it's just like a packaging, like what clothes am I gonna wear? It's like, oh yeah, put on those Sagittarius clothes. So choosing brand colors that are bright and vibrant from that Sagittarius aspect, it's like, oh yep, check, Pam's done that.


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Pam: This is awesome. And so applying astrology, using your framework is to really step into that personal brand, whether it's a business or you are working for a company. And it will help you kind of like step into the power that's already within, just in a, in a much kind of like amplified way. 

Leslie: Yeah. I think of it as like, kind of like you hear like a lot of spiritual entrepreneurs, I'll talk about like alignment and attunement, but it's really about becoming the best version of yourself. Because more often than not, you're already expressing these elements, but they might be shadow expressions like Sagittarius shadow could be a lot of judgment. Or that Scorpio shadow could be a lot of like distrust. That Leo Shadow could be a lot of domineering, right? And so you're, then you can check yourself. You're like, Oh yeah, I'm not trusting myself. Oh yeah. I'm judging myself. Oh yeah. I'm like trying to hog up all the attention. Right. You make these little shifts and it's like a never ending journey, a never ending exploration. There's always a layer deeper you can go into these archetypal energies.

Pam: So much. I wanna talk about your thoughts cuz you talk about traditional astrology and I have a client actually that she's been teaching yoga for like, I don't know, 25 years or something. And so I don't know how we landed on a conversation about astrology and she was like, But the astrology that you are used to is not the one that I follow, because the astrology that you are used to is starts on Jesus Christ birthdate. And she said, I've been in this world before he was born. And I was like, what? 

Leslie: Yes.

Pam: So let's take a quick coffee break and then we'll come back and talk about that. 

Leslie: Okay.


Pam: So Leslie, do you drink coffee? 

Leslie: I drink coffee, yes I do.

Pam: What's your favorite way of brewing coffee? 

Leslie: Well, I tend to leave my brewing coffee to my husband, who is much more particular to his coffee. And if it was up to him, it would be French Press some kind of like dark roast, like I think on our house we probably go through like a thousand dollars of Peets beans a month or so, something like that. 

Pam: How many cups of coffee do you drink a day?! 

Leslie: Well, it's not even, I drink one, but his coffee, he puts like, I don't know, so many beans to like just make one french press. I'm like, this is a little too strong for me personally. So I put some extra water in there and he's like, blasphemy! But I do prefer, I'm not into the third wave coffee, all those like fruity, um, bitter coffees. I like the Peets and the dark roasts and just kind of those richer coffees. 

Pam: Nice. So he makes you coffee every day? 

Leslie: Yeah, he does. He, he makes me coffee every day because I love coffee and I will drink it like one cup a day, but I'm not somebody who needs it and like my husband like just can't even function if he doesn't have his first cup. 

Pam: Nice, nice. On my end, I am drinking. I'm in Colorado, in the land of Cheyenne today and I just drank regular coffee today. I've been traveling, it's been an insane last 10 days, and so I just had a regular, just Greca, I don't know what the name is in English. It's the Cuban espresso maker. It's a very old form of brewing coffee. And so that's been kind of like my latest. I'm typically a pour over kind of brewer, it takes a long time. If you wanna do it right, all the coffee purists will be like, Ooh, you're not doing it right. Cause you have to measure and wait and you know too much. And so I've been doing the Greca style, which is just an espresso. You put it over the stove. It's a very ancient way of making coffee, but it's so good. 

Leslie: Oh, I think I've seen those. Is that the, has like the little portion on the bottom and the bigger portion on top? And then it kind of percolates up.

Pam: Yes.

Leslie: Ooh, my old roommate had one of those. That was good coffee. 

Pam: So good. Yes. All right, let's get back to the show.


Pam: So, Leslie, we were talking about this kind of like statement that my client gave me about astrology. 

Leslie: Oh yes.

Pam: So I was very confused. I was left with a lot of questions and our call was over, and then I've been pondering on this and I'm like, Well, Leslie's coming. Maybe I'll ask her.

Leslie: Yeah, for sure. So there's a lot of different, like you can call it modalities or techniques and like different astrology languages.  Like almost every culture has some kind of form of astrology, which really combines science, right? The astronomy part of it with cosmology, like the creation story of that particular culture. All cultures, like Mayan culture has their own astrology, Chinese culture, Hawaiian culture. We all have their own astrology. Now I'm a product of Western civilization. Take it, leave it, like love it, all the colonialism from it, and I love western astrology, but some of its language is very gendered, very restrictive, very fatalistic, very like fear mongering. Like, Oh, you have all these like bad planets, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Right. Now what I suspect, and I didn't hear that conversation with you and your yoga teacher, I suspect because of that yoga practice that she was talking about jyotish or vedic astrology, which is the unbroken astrology from the Indian subcontinent. Right? And so the biggest difference between western astrology, which you know the listeners are probably most familiar with and vedic astrology, is that vedic astrology looks at the position of the actual constellations. And as the sun is going through the different constellations, like that is the season. But there's this term called procession of the zodiac. Basically the timing, what she's talking about, that timing when Jesus Christ was born, and I think she got her facts a little bit wrong, but when astrology, western astrology, when we started documenting astrology, and they would look at the vernal equinox, so the equinox that happen in the spring. And so the equinoxes and the solstice is, are really important times astrologically because the sun is at certain markers. And so when the sun would rise in the eastern horizon on the equinox day, meaning both the night and the day where equal balance like, ancients in all civilizations would mark these two times in the spring and the fall when they have balance of day and night. So equinoxes for equal, right? When astrology started being created, when the sun would be rising, the constellation Aries was rising at that equinox. And so Aries season started. Now this idea of procession, of the pre-session of the zodiac because we're in a galaxy and the solar system is going around the now the galactic center, which is what we know as a black hole now, the zodiac, the consolation shift about a degree every 72 years. Over the course of 72 plus 72, you know, now we're in the thousands of years at that Equinox, at the tail end of Pisces is now rising at that Equinox, not Aries. So Western astrologers don't say like, Oh, so this Pisces Energy is here on the vernal Equinox. They just say that every time it's vernal equinox Aries season starts. Whereas in Vedic astrology,on that day of like around March 21st, March 22nd, they're like, Oh no, it's Pisces. 

Pam: Okay.

Leslie: Okay. And so now we're even ending Pisces. And so if you've ever heard of like the Age of Aquarius, what this means is that we're at the end of, of Pisces, and now it's like Aquarius that is starting to rise on that vernal Equinox instigating the age of Aquarius. That's like the mechanics behind what she's saying. And so the Vedic astrologers had had a unbroken astrology context for 4,000 years, whereas Western astrology, when the rise of Christianity came, astrology went into the underground because there was, you know, like if you aren't listening to the Pope and like the bishops, like you didn't have access to God. Like total BS, right? We all have access to God. 

Pam: Mm-hmm. That's what my grandma believed.

Leslie: Yes. And you know, like there's beautiful parts of Christianity. I'm not like throwing shade on Christianity, but like the dogma of Christianity and religion to like, you know, take your power away and take your money away and say this is the only way to connect to God. That's what's F'ed up about that. Right. And so with Western astrology, the tradition was broken and so. There was a huge renaissance of astrology in the Renaissance ages. So there was like probably a thousand years of a breakup of astrological tradition in the West. And when it came back in the Renaissance tradition, it was like steeped in like the deepest, most patriarchal versions of astrology, right? Because in the, in the Renaissance, you know, to be a woman was to be chaste and to be pure, you're either a mother or a whore. And so we had a lot of like this bad language come up in these renaissance traditions that do not fit our modern interpretations. And so anyone who's practicing astrology,  this language is coming from your own personal experience, right? Like whether you have a dialect or you have certain slang words. And so if you'll hear me talking about astrology differently than another person talks about astrology because of my own experiences and my own astrological makeup. And so for me, my mission is to really bring astrology out of those kind of dark ages and to talk about it in a more empowering and equitable and change making kind of way.  And I think that's why people like my style of astrology, because I'm like, No, we don't have to talk about Mars as being like this, you know, machismo kind of energy. It's like Mars activates and advocate. That's what I'm here to do.

Pam: I love that. Thank you for like the explanation, the technicality. It made sense. It made sense.

Leslie: And one thing I wanted to add, what I really, really, really dislike is when as strollers say, it's this way and every other way is wrong. I've always hated that about people in religion or spirituality. It also exists in astrology. If you hear somebody say it's this one way or no way at all, then like red flag, red flag, red flag. Because we are all here to find our own way. There are infinite paths to the same destination. 

Pam: I agree 100%. It's a white supremacist principle. One of the things that I do in businesses, I decolonize businesses, and especially when it comes to marketing, it's, you know, Edward Barclay, is that his name? I hope I'm saying it right. You know, the father of public relations and marketing used a lot of oppressive practices to manipulate the minds of humans and to this day we use a lot of those practices and I'm a questioner. I don't know if that's in my chart, but, I often question things like, why, why do we do this? And so when I got into business, I, I was like, a lot of these things feel like yucky. And even me doing like working with other business coaches and doing different things, they would be like, this is what you do, and you put a timer. And I was like, Wait, this doesn't feel right. You know? And so that's when I started really, I went into looking at business from the lens of like, how could we decolonize the practices that have been oppressing people that look like you and I? And one of those is [inaudible], which is it's either my way or not, which is wrong. So to your point, I agree. So let's decolonize astrology as well. 

Leslie: Yes. We're decolonizing astrology. And actually somebody already wrote the book on decolonizing astrology.

Pam: Nice!

Leslie: There's an astrologer. Their name is Alice Sparkly Kat. And such a brilliant writer. I found their work after I was already doing my version of decolonizing. I didn't know I was decolonizing. But that's what I was doing. [laughs] And so yeah, all of those things that we learn about, like we can't rest, we can't play, we have to work hard, we have to do all these things. It can all be reframed in our astrology. It's so beautiful. 

Pam: I love that. Tell us where we can find you.

Leslie: Yes! So a couple of places you can find me. I spend a lot of time on Facebook and Instagram. On Instagram my handle, there's a lot of fakers right now, and so this is really hard. But Instagram, look for me at New Moon Creatives Co. And on Facebook. I have a free Facebook group called The Savvy Luminary. I'm in transition right now. Perfect timing. There's so many wonderful things going on in the stars right now. Just a lot of shake ups and I've been calling things like repatriation and just so many beautiful things. Might not just be super comfortable right here and right now, but trust in this process. Don't bypass the uncomfortable feelings. Get curious with what those feelings are. It's gonna put you on your highest path. 

Pam: I will receive that because, oh my gosh.Leslie, how could a business owner, cause the majority of the people that I work with, they own their business. How could they use their chart perhaps to kind of like work with their business? I know that's something that you do, and I'll put a little like comment here and maybe it's part of my chart, so I do have to enjoy what I do. I've met with a lot of people that are like, Oh, I did market research and this is what was the need, like, I don't know. I met someone who has a company that they sell socks. And when I asked them, I'm like, why socks? Like, do you love socks that much? And he's like, No, I did market research first and I uncovered that, you know, there's a, like a huge market in the sock industry. And so I decided-- and I'm like, What? Like you what? That's so weird to me. Like I have to, to me, I have to start with like in my core, like, I wanna do this, but I guess not everyone. So how could someone use their chart to see if maybe their path is correct or work with their business?

Leslie: Yeah, that's a good question. That is something that is really, really hard to answer, because there are so many different expressions. And so what I would recommend when people are looking at their chart, right, and you know your friend who's running that sock business, right? They're obviously like money is important to them. They're not running a values led, purposeful, visionary business like that person not out here to make change, right? Like make change in their bank account. For the listeners who are not of that kind of category, you know, again, going back to your Sun and just like really amplifying that zone of genius, making sure that whatever work that you are in, that you're advocating and creating opportunities to work in that brilliance of your Sun sign. For more ease and for more confidence and for more joy, making sure that your moon sign is being satisfied by your work. And I remember the one time I, I had this one client who was just like, my business can emotionally satisfy me? And she was like, shocked. And I was like, your business needs to emotionally satisfy you if you are running your own business. Like, don't create a business that drains you. 

Pam: Yes, Yes. 

Leslie: And so, and knowing what success also your moon sign tells you what success is. And so if you're always chasing those outward expressions of success, like money or followers, or you know, accolades and things like that, you're still never going to be fully satisfied until you satisfy that inward markers of success that you can see in your Moon sign. Okay. So really satisfying those inner needs makes you more confident, makes you feel more like successful. And then that's when those outward markers start to follow. And then your Rising sign really diving in and stepping into that leadership style. Because as a business owner or you know, any changemaker. You are a leader, whether you're leading a team of five or if you're leading an entire movement, it doesn't matter. You are a leader and there's infinite amounts of types of leadership, and your rising sign will show you that archetypal energy that you need to step with your right foot first to lead. 

Pam: Another thing that I teach my clients that are womb carriers, childbearing, people that bleed and, and those actually every human actually, because I will use the moon. I created a course called Inés, and it's to help you align your activities based on your menstrual cycle and those who don't bleed, whether they don't have a womb or uterus I guess, or they just don't bleed, then we work with the moon. 

Leslie: Yeah, the phases of the moon.

Pam: With the phases of the moon. And so one question that I always get is like the Full and the New Moon rituals, how important are those? And that's something that you touched on. Could you tell us more about the Full Moon and the New Moon? Cause people are often confused.

Leslie: Yes, for sure. So what is really happening at a New Moon, why it's called new, is that the sun and the moon are meeting at the exact place in the sky. And so, a new moon is a place of, if you think about going back to that ideation of that, the womb space, right? Or for those of us who don't have wombs, thinking about like a galactic star nursery where there's just like darkness and chaos and mystery, but has all the pieces that you need to sprout something. And so that New Moon phase is a phase of initiation, of starts, where anything is possible. And like I was talking like I got into using astrology for business because it just kept on working for me and my friends when we got every month super intentional about asking and getting clear for what we want. Now, whether you do this on a new moon or you just make a monthly practice of it, you can experiment. The most important thing is to get clear on what you want. Which, you know, so many of us are just like floating through lives. And going, Oh, why is my business not doing what I want it to do? It's like, Well, what do you want it to do? I don't know. Right?

Pam: Bring me money. That's it.

Leslie: And the New Moon is our opportunity to say like, Okay, so you know, for you, Pam, with this new moon that is today, activating your eighth house of Deep transformation, or eighth houses is also other people's money. So joint resources, money that your clients earn, if you wanna take out a loan or get an investor, the eighth house is all about those joint resources. So you might be saying like, Ooh, I wanna create this app and I need to get some angel funding, so I'm gonna create an intention to raise half a million dollars to build this app out. Today would be perfect for you to do that. I'm getting really clear on like, okay, I want half a million dollars or more. I wanna do this with the money. I wanna feel like this with the money. Putting all those things and getting really clear. And I recommend having a journal that has all these intentions in one place cuz it's so beautiful to flip back and go, oh yeah, I did that, check. Oh yeah, I did that, check. Now the full moon phase is an illumination where the sun and the moon are sitting across each other from the sky.  This is when we see the full moon, because the sun is shining all its light onto the moon. And the full moon is a time of making decisions. And so an opposition is always making a choice. To decide is to kill something off and commit. That's a little bit of a violent term, but that's the entomology of the word. And so in a full moon phase, you can use the sign of the moon and kind of look back six months ago when the moon was new and say, Okay, did I accomplish this goal? Am I making any progress on this intention? Do I still want this? Do I not want this? What's really holding me back? Or did I accomplish it? You're kind of like illuminating to make your next decision. And so both of these phases are really important because a new moon phase is like you're planting the seed by the full moon phase it's like it's come in like fruition and things are starting to bud. But if you've ever grown a fruit tree or any kind of fruiting plants or vegetables, you know that you have to prune those things so that your fruits become much more potent and have better, healthier fruits. Otherwise, everything is just kind of scraggly. And so that full moon phase is about celebration and release. So think about it as like that kind of pruning phase. 

Pam: So fun. I grew up with a very spiritual dad, right? And one of the things that he would always say is like, you have the answer. You know, like, you don't have to make things complicated. And I learned, I guess from a young age that a ritual could be like sitting on the grass. It could be sitting down for my, like, it doesn't have to be this overcomplicated, like we go into the woods and like, you know, dress in white and do all these things. And so even for Full Moon and New Moon, like rituals, I guess, I make them very simple, but is there like what do you recommend? 

Leslie: Yeah, I think simple is great because if it's simple, you're gonna do it. And you know what? Kudos to your dad for sharing with you such like divine wisdom at such a young age. Like, I love that. But if we can think of like a ritual as really like a container for the space, this container that holds your intention. So it can be a small container, something really easy. It could be something like elaborate where you're making offerings and you're tying it up in leaves and like throwing it into the river to go out. Like it could be like all of those things. But to create the container is simply to begin and say like, I'm initiating a container right now. You might wanna call in your spirit guides, your healthy ancestors, your angels, whoever helps you at that moment, you know, in, in that container. Then you can start to journal or get clear on your intentions. Maybe you make an offering. Then you thank your spirit guides, ask them to help you with manifesting this intention because spirit guides are really there. They want to help you. They're just waiting for you to ask. And then you close it up with gratitude, you may have an offering. That's it. That's it. Simple.

Pam: Yeah, I'm a big fan of like, because to your point, then you will make it happen. Otherwise it's like, ah, yeah, I don't have the, you know, the tub and the flower pets and like, and so , if you just have a journal and a pen. The other thing that I learned from you actually is to work with your moon sign, moon rituals, do you work with your moon sign with, um, element of your moon sign? So like me being a Leo Moon, I always have fire so I light a candle or like, that's basically it. I'm not gonna go out in the woods and like--

Leslie: Burn things. [laughs] Burn things safely. Yeah. It's great to work with your moon sign. It's also great to work with the element of the current moon sign. So we're dealing with Leo Moon and you have that Leo moon, so, you know, celebrating like, Leo moon is ruled by the sun, so maybe celebrating the sun in your own way, doing a sun salutation or something with fire, wearing gold or something bright. One of the things that when you're working with astrology and starting to live by the moon is like you're just kind of aligning to, its kind of natural ebb and flow and so I tend to normally like dress to the moon, like if it, today's Leo New Moon. I don't know if I'm wearing any gold right now, but I try to wear like this bright yellow shirt, I have some gold on and you know, just like extra yumminess to the sun. I feel like once you start to attune, you start to notice all of the universes symbols and signals that were always there just waiting for you to notice.

Pam: Yeah, even like not being able to sleep, the full moon wakes me up all the time.

Leslie: Full moons are terrible for sleeping. Take your CBN and just like, okay. [laughs] 

Pam: Yes, relax. Well, actually what I started doing when I know, you know, full moon's coming, I'm like, Okay, I'm just gonna choose a project that's gonna take me longer, so I won't go to sleep  until I'm really tired. So I kinda work with it. 

Leslie: I love that.

Pam: Cause I have extra energy, so you know, can't beat 'em, join 'em type thing. 

Leslie: Exactly.

Pam: Could you make decisions based on your chart? 

Leslie: Oh my goodness, yes. You can easily make decisions on your chart. I mean, just thinking about your big three, Sun, Moon, Rising can make that decision making so much more easy, right? Like first thing, trust yourself. Always trust yourself. Like your dad said to you, Your dad is telling all of us, you already know. [laughs] And the Sun, you're making decisions to always allow yourself to create opportunities that allow you to work in your Sun's zone of genius. Your moon is helping you decide, it's like, is this gonna emotionally satisfy me or is this like, you know, like if somebody said, Hey, I'm gonna pay you a lot of money, Pam, but you gotta go work in this office down in the basement and not talk to anybody. You'd be like, no, I need to be around people who love me.

Pam: Yes. Okay. So always look at your, your top three. 

Leslie: Yep.

Pam: Like, to start. 

Leslie: Always, they will always lead you correctly.

Pam: Leslie, last two questions that we ask in the show. Do you have a remedy that you wanna share?

Leslie: So, you know, we're Filipinos, right? And Filipinos are a very big pork culture from like lechon to bacon to just like everything, pig's feet soup. Oh my god, my grandma made the best pig's feet soup. Don't gross out. It was delicious. My grandma always said, if you're going to eat like any like fatty meat, you always have to pair it with a bitter fruit or vegetable. So bitter melon, cabbage, kale, broccoli. You know, there's other like, um, I can't, I don't know the English names. I, I don't even know the Filipino names. It's like my grandma's like, go get that smooth melon. Okay. Yeah.

Pam: So you pair them with fatty meats? 

Leslie: Yes. I re if you're going to eat like bacon, eat arugula. If you're gonna eat lechón, eat like a cabbage salad or something. Like always pair fatty meats with some kind of bitter vegetableto keep your cholesterol down. 

Pam: And do you have a quote or mantra that you live by in this moment, in this chapter of your life?

Leslie: In this chapter of my life, I am coming at a blank. I know that there's so many things, but it has to do with just being in ease and flow. 

Pam: Being at ease and flow. I mean, maybe that's it. You know, like be present.

Leslie: Just-- Yes, be present. That's my lesson right now. Cuz when I was like really freaking out about money, it would always be like, money comes easily to me. And so anytime I'm working on a mantra, it's always like something is coming easily to me now. 

Pam: For sure, for sure. Yes. You know, actually that's something that I feel like it's a lesson right now in this like last few weeks because there was a tragedy that happened in my family, and so I dropped things because I had to, you know, I, like, I was talking to, to a friend about this and I'm like, you know, I realized that my business can be very simple. Like I don't have to over complicate things or overgive and under char-- Like, it can be very simple. And I think this is one, like, I don't know if it has to do with the moon and the stars or, uh, but I, this is the moment for me that I'm like, I'm gonna cut a ton of things because for two weeks I didn't do them and nobody complained. Like nobody called me and was like, we're missing, you know, whatever. And so simplifying would be my season right now[?]

Leslie: One of the big astrological events that is coming up at the end of the month is the meetup of the north node, which is like our collective potential, like where us, like collective, we're all going towards Uranus, the planet of awakening and change and revolution, and Mars, the planet of activation, heats taking action, fighting the good fights. And this three Mars, Uranus, and North Node in the sign of Taurus. This is like a once in a 84 year kind of activity and it is seismic and it is revolutionary. Taurus is about our physical resources, so you've heard astrologers talking about maybe, you know, the financial things going on. It's like, yes, we're going through financial uncertainty right now. Food uncertainty. Environmental uncertainty, all those things, yes. The way I see it actually happening, this revolution is that we are dismantling all of these constructs around there for sustainability and for the long term so that we can all thrive. And so I've been calling this rematriation, so we've heard of repatriation, but what we're really doing is we are, we're returning spirit back to ourselves and back to land. And that's how I see that little archetype happening. Yes, on top of the earthquakes that are actually happening, yes on top of all these other things. But I'm sorry to hear about the family tragedy because to me, like the unexpected I, and I don't know anything, but I'm guessing that it was unexpected. 

Pam: Yes.

Leslie: And that is one of the things that we can say, okay, how can we prepare ourselves for the unexpected and how can we remedy, remediate so that we can sometimes not be subject to the unexpectedness, but instead create unexpectedness in our lives and our works to remediate. So I was telling my clients to remedy where in your life or your work would you just tear the bandaid off? Right. Just shock to remediate any shocks happening and coming at you. And so that's another remedy.

Pam: That's a great remedy right there. We, we can leave everyone with those thoughts because this is coming out on Sunday, so.

Leslie: Perfect. And that's exactly when this transit is going to be at maximum impact. 

Pam: So if you're listening as this episode comes out on Sunday, then take action. What do you need to rip off? 

Leslie: Tear the bandaid off!

Pam: Yes. Yes. Oof. Leslie, thank you so much for being on Café con Pam sharing all the things. 

Leslie: Thank you for having me. This was so much fun. We'll have to do this again. You'll come on my podcast and let's chat more. 

Pam: Yeah. I'm so down. I'm so down. And thank you for reading me and covering all my things. That's so fun. What's next for you? Is there a project that you wanna talk about?

Leslie: Yes, actually, I would love that. And, um, I can send you a special link for your guests, right? So I offer this twice a year live, and it's kind of like my foundational offer. If you are interested in beginning to work with astrology in your change making work and in your business, I have my mini training called Written in the Stars, where I teach you the language of how I look at astrology so that you can begin to start working with astrology in your work. So I teach you all of the planets, the signs, the houses, and the aspects. And so even if you know astrology, this new empowering and equitable way of learning these planetary symbols, and if you're completely new to astrology, I teach you how to read all 360 degrees of your natal chart. I offer it live twice a year. So we start on August 22nd, and I would love to invite you and your people to join with me for starting to use Written in the Stars. So you can go to It's easy, right, /pam. And you can find information on how to connect with me and there'll be a free mantra download for you as well as, um, Written in the Stars where you can get a discount using your coupon code. 

Pam: Stay Shining.

Leslie: Stay shining! We'll have that in the show notes. 

Pam: Yes, we will. Thank you. I actually, I think that's the one that I did. 

Leslie: I think so. A couple-- like last year? 

Pam: Yes. 

Leslie: Yeah. What'd you think of it? 

Pam: So good. 

Leslie: It's so good.

Pam: I mean, I learned so much and I still like, I need to reread some of the things cause I'm like, houses and all the things that-- I don't know, but I leave it to the professionals. So I just, I read your emails and then I quote you and I'm like, this is what Leslie said to do with this moon, so, go for it.

Leslie: Aw. Thanks Pam.

Pam: Thank you. Thank you for sharing all the things. This was super fun Indeed. And I would love to bring you back and maybe, I don't know, we could have listener letters or something. 

Leslie: Oh gosh, yes. Anytime. 

Pam: You know, because there's always astrology questions and I'm like, Look, I'm not an astrologer. I know about the sun, the moon, and the rising. That's it. 

Leslie: I would love that, anytime Pam.

Pam: All right, well, thank you so, so much again. 

Leslie: Listeners, stay shining! You are a luminary.


All right, listeners, and that was my conversation with Leslie. What do you think? We could have kept going, definitely, we could have kept going for hours and hours, talking about all the things astrology, talking about business, talking about personal branding, all of the things. But I'm hoping that this conversation served you and you maybe are now more curious about astrology. Definitely follow her. Subscribe to her newsletter. She, like, shares so much content that's so good and it helps you just learn a little bit more about your yourself. Because why not? If you'll listen to me, I'm sure you're someone who's curious about who you are and all the things identity and all the things while we're here into this world. So the stars can help you do so with the help of Leslie. And one thing that I started sharing in the beginning that I said I was gonna share was that, at the end of the recording, we'll kind of hang out afterwards, and I don't know where she looked in my chart, but basically she told me about my ideal client and how to use your chart to uncover that if you are a business owner, or even I would say if you are an employee, how to best communicate with the people that you work with. 

So it was really, really cool to kind of like uncover those things. And those are all in my chart, which makes so much sense that for me as a business coach, even though there's a plethora of other business coaches out there, I have a unique recipe that I can offer. And one of the things that Leslie confirmed is that, is that, literally that I have a unique recipe that I can offer that nobody else has. And it felt so good to hear it and to learn it from like that lens that it's like, oh no, it's like you are here for this and this is who are you are supposed to work with and this is how your message is to be said. And so it was really cool. So I'm grateful for that. Thank you, Leslie, for sharing all those things. It's, I took notes, listeners, I took notes. So, I definitely recommend you taking advantage of that incredible offer that she gave us to take her star powered course. I took it, it helped me a ton, and she's given us 10% off for being a Café con Pam listeners, so head over to We're gonna have that in the show notes and get your 10% off because it's so worth it. I still use it actually to this day. If you are in  the Stay Shining Club, if you're in the Discord group, I often quote Leslie because it's powerful. 

Now that I said that, thank you for being here. If this is your first time, I hope you enjoyed this episode. I hope you choose to subscribe. This is the time when I invite you to subscribe, rate and review whichever platform you're on. If you are in Apple Podcast, it allows you to do all of the above so you can subscribe, rate and review. If you are in Goodpods, for example, it allows you to rate the episode. That's what's really cool about Goodpods. You can rate. Individual episode and tell me what you think about that individual episode, which is kind of cool. And if you feel called to leave a review in whichever platform you are, a couple of questions that I can leave you with to think about to get you started is what do you love about the show? What were you experiencing before you listened? What happened after you listened? And how would you describe the show to your best friend? If you were talking to somebody and you were like, Oh, you should listen to this podcast because "fill in the blank". 

I wanna thank you so much for being here, for your time, for lending me your ears each and every week or each time you decide to binge Café con Pam. I know that happens as well. Thank you so, so much. I would love to stay connected. Social media is the easiest one @cafeconpampodcast, both on Instagram and Facebook. You know, I have my days with social media and I have my days when I don't like social media, so don't expect me to be there all the time. I kind of show up in social media once a month. So let's hang out there though nonetheless. If you tag me on your stories and I miss it, I'm so sorry, but I do see it and I so appreciate it. Thank you so much. You can also check out the online gathering space that I have. It's That's where we can hang out. That's where we show up every morning and we say thanks. We give gratitude. We commit to doing one thing because you know, as a recovering procrastinator, I'm all about productivity and making things happen for own highest good with ease and joy, and so is where we can continue to stay connected and have conversations and share things, all the things. 

You can also check out my work. There's two free challenges that you can join, the Stay Organized Challenge and the Daily Tapping Challenge. I recommend the Daily Tapping Challenge first and then you can go into the Get Organized because we tap for five days and it's five minutes. Five days, you can build a practice. I recommend you keeping it. Lots of people in the Stay Shining Club, they share like, Hey, I tapped in ZIP today. And it's one of those if you know, you know type things. So for that, you can just head over to and you will find the challenge there. And it is my gift to you where you can join us. 

You can also check out my paid work. I do have a, a couple of offers depending on where you are and who you are. I am a firm believer in equitable businesses, and so I do have low paying offers and I do have a higher paying offers depending on where you are and who you are. So for that, go to There's a tab there or like a menu item, I don't know what to call it, like somewhere in there that says "work with me". And that's where you can see the different offers that I have for you. And if you are curious about other ways to work, there are some that are not listed, actually. Send me a message and just be like, Hey, I would like to work with you in this way. Why not? If it brings us joy, like Leslie told me, we can explore. 

Y bueno, that's my update for the episode. As far as I go, I know last episode was kind of like, actually the last two episodes, the episode with Ashley, I kinda like broke down at the end. It's because I had just received some news, like literally that day and I was very raw. And so the following episode that came after came from producer Nancy. Shout out to producer Nancy. Who you know, I'm so grateful for the team that makes Café con Pam, because I had to literally drop everything and get on a plane that day. And so, I'm grateful that I have the support from incredible humans that were like, don't worry about it. We'll send emails, we'll reschedule things, and we'll even make your intro for the episode. So we were able to share an episode even in times of tragedy for me. And so I hope you enjoyed last week's episode, and when I'm ready, I will share more with you. I do wanna say, please do take care of your mental health. I've been talking about mental health since 2015, everyone, and I've been called all kinds of things because mental health is still so stigmatized. And if you feel that you are alone, if you feel like life is getting hard, please do reach out. Please send me a message. I do have resources. I may not have all the answers, but I do have resources that I can send you to, to support you. And there's always a way. I'm also thinking about offering like a monthly tapping circle to support us because mental health is real and I have tools that can support you and I have resources of other people that can support you. So please don't feel alone. Your life is important and your existence in this world matters. And so I will leave you with that. 

If you're still here, like, oh my gosh, when I share the episode on Instagram, drop the word "gummy bear". We'll see. We'll see if you're still here and I don't know, maybe I'll send you something as a thank you for being here. Y bueno, with that I will leave you back to your daily duties, wWhatever you're doing, and como siempre, stay shining!